Looking at the results for the past week I conclude that this is the cut off point - to stop betting on the turf - and time to turn my attention to the NH and AW !!

Who still feels confident carrying on with the Turf ??

I also think that VDW works better on the NH

"I do find it quite amusing that you can use facts and reasons after the race to prove your points, and that seems to be expectable." 12:30pm

It's not your use of facts and figures that amuses me. It is that fact you can use it after a race and it is ok. 04:15pm

Mtoto,

Again you dont seem to be either reading or understanding my posts, (I will not be so impertinent as to suggest you just want to mindlessly rant and rave at me). if I quote M Johnstons stats at Ascot they were based on 231 races, admittedly this is after the event but how else are statistics gathered.

Wouldnt you agree to accuse me of aftertiming seems a little off the target? Every other correspondent to this thread classifies aftertiming as claiming a winner after the race.

Perhaps you could suggest another manner more acceptable to yourself that I could substitute for trainer stats and that would still serve to demonstrate trainer consistency?

Jd,

I committed an error when calculating how many victories were gained by Mana D' Argent (6) and Royal Rebel (2). The total is of course 8 not seven.

However I looked at their last three form figs before each win and they are more my allies than my enemies!

Mana D' Argent first then Royal Rebel:
-000
-660
-007
-134
-837
-303
-208
-669

JIB I asked because I thought you was 'after timing' !

Ectoo
Loved that one!
Bet I wasn't the only one on the floor.

tc,
dont think its time to quit on the turf yet,but i cant wait for the all weather.
will be taking a closer look at regal gallery later,entered wed ling

greg -

do you use time figs on the AW ?

tc,
no i dont

tc,
what i do find usefull as a guide,not just on aw,is comparing the rpr as its now called to a horses official raring in hcaps of previous runs for a horses form guide.but you must also take into account a horse can still run well even if it below its or

its not the be all and end all but its a fair guide

thanks greg -

I intend to have a good look at the AW over the winter - I think that despite its reputation - it could be very "Punter Friendly"

Whoever mentioned birdwatching had a point, VDW thread watching is more on those lines.

i think aw will continue to improve,the prize money has been increased this year.
i love aw racing in the winter,i just could not continue backing jumpers,who were travelling well looking the winner and falling.
so i dont even look at jumps any more,which also gives more time to concentrate on one area.

nessie,
so run me through this trading
5-30 wind
i think branston tiger is too big at 12 on betfair,so i bet at 12 and lay it in the afternoon at shorter?

Greg,

I know your question was directed at Nessie, but, yes - spot on. The following link is also useful for working out your stake on the trade when the odds allow, I know it's labelled as an arb tool but think it is a trade tool - could argue the details but both are non lose investments.

http://www.ukhorseracing.co.uk/tools/SimpleArb.asp

Lee,

Regarding the last 2f comments. Would Pipedreamer (the horse not the member ), Rhyme Royal, Tesoro Mio, Black Minstrel, Red Rufus and Sea Chimes fall into what you're looking at? The year is 1979 - does this make me the best after timer of all?

Nofinepix: best question for donkey's.

Epi,

Which question the 2f comments or the best after timer?

Sorry, I'm too drunk to distinguish, I'm not even sure if I meant "donkey's years" or VDW "donkeys".