yes lost a lot of money on a horse at edinburgh viking somthing.under estimated the draw[again]it come out next time out in a biggish race at a good track and going up in class at a big price could not understand it at the time.while watching the race at edinburgh you could see it was never winning because of the draw. because it was going up in class did,nt bet it next time it may have been 25/1 or something

JohnD,
Thanks for the reply, you obviously pay more heed to course configuration than I do (maybe I need to pay more attention to it!)
can i ask a question, if Binocular was to line up in a theoretical race at Cheltenham over the same distance, going and class as his Aintree win, would you select him?
My reasoning behind the question is I believe it was an outstanding performance of such dominance we would have got the same result no matter where that race was run.

so i think then this should be tied in with consistancy,the horse has ran better than bare rating because of ,draw,going,configuration,class,distance,jockey

It gets complicated at times Les but if a horse runs well i.e. placed ask yourself why?.It may also be worth asking why a certain stable is placing more than one horse in a race at any given time since the last try btn a sh/hd at Donny?.

to help with weight compression?,to give said horse advantage with where in the handicap it maybe placed and of course the other horses are better,more than likely getting ready for another day and as vdw says fast run place lto its coming to the boil

Thanks for putting that up WP. When I've a sec, (and not too busy doing important things like anagrams - I'm easily distracted), I'll compare it to the handy reference sheets I printed off from Mtoto's links.

quote:

to help with weight compression?,to give said horse advantage with where in the handicap it maybe placed and of course the other horses are better

Not in this instance les, its actually only the last 5 races since the Newmarket defeat when fav, my mistake.

recouping loses

used to watch for this a lot but kind of gave up on it nicholls sprinters,chapman,cant think who your scottish trainer maybe with semple gone ,monteith?

putting out a marker wattie?

quote:

Originally posted by Regal Exile:
if Binocular was to line up in a theoretical race at Cheltenham over the same distance, going and class as his Aintree win, would you select him?
My reasoning behind the question is I believe it was an outstanding performance of such dominance we would have got the same result no matter where that race was run.

RE

It depends entirely on what he was racing against and what pace it was run at. There's no doubt the horse could win good races at Cheltenham, but I seriously doubt he would have had Celestial Halo's measure at that course.
Binocular is a general 7/1 for next season's Champion Hurdle, but he won't be racing against novices then, and I wouldn't touch him at twice the price.

Thanks, Walter.

Very useful information all in one place!

----

For all those doing course study, it may be worth noting where an animal runs its first ever race
and

where it wins its maiden race.

On one forum, a dude looked into this and found that Newbury was a good starting place for profitable flat runners.

The stats may well be based on a bit of logic; maybe certain good trainers have a pattern?

You jumps lads and Scotsmen may be able to spot one in your neck of the woods.

how did your day go at the national sean

This message has been edited. Last edited by: les henderson,

if Binocular was to line up in a theoretical race at Cheltenham over the same distance, going and class as his Aintree win, would you select him?
My reasoning behind the question is I believe it was an outstanding performance of such dominance we would have got the same result no matter where that race was run.

RE,

I think many will come to the same conclusion as yourself. However the real question is would B be able to repeat that performance on a stiff undulating course. Or would his speed be blunted by the ups and downs and then the hill? In essence the Aintree race was a two horse race as the top two outclassed the rest, he only had one horse to beat. Can/would he win race of that class at Cheltenham, that would depend on the competition? At this moment in time I wouldn't back him to up hold the form with CH, let alone the likes of Katchit etc.

never though about trainers sending out horses on courses that the configuration was all wrong,is this common or very common.

Walter,

The main problem is many (including some trainers) think a good horse can act on any course. While this to an extent is true/right there is a big difference between acting on the course, and performing to ones best. For me Celestial Halo acted on the flat speed course, he would have beaten a lot of good horses judging by that performace, he just couldn't beat one the course suited better. So fair enough the trainer ran him on the wrong course for THAT race, but is it the wrong course for other races, that would depend on the competition?

Be Lucky

The Sportinglife website carries some good info as well click on racing then courses.
Im not sure ive entered the Binocular debate mtoto are you getting me mixed up with someone else?.

Looking at the Sportinglife website they have Musselburgh as suited to long striding galloping types???? who is writing this stuff?.

Welcome to Musselburgh






Draw Advantage:
In races up to a mile high numbers are usually at an advantage.


A right handed dual purpose Flat and National Hunt track which is level throughout and on the sharp side. Suits a long striding galloping type and front runners have an excellent record. Extremes of going are rare as the track drains well. The fences can be tricky.


The racecourse stands alongside the famous Musselburgh golf course and was converted into a jumps track in 1987. The standard of racehorse is only moderate but the facilities are good with customers able to choose between two restaurants and a number of snack bars.



Directions:


By road

JohnD, Mtoto,
Thanks for the input giving me plenty to ponder upon between now and next jumps season.
My eyes told me I had seen an outstanding performance by Binocular and I can't see him winning next years champion, however the Christmas Hurdle at kempton and the Fighting Fifth at Newcastle should be at his mercy.
Cheers

In the profit from weights right book he has Musselburgh down for suiting the same type a long striding galloper?.
Let me tell you now that if a long strinding galloper goes into the far turn at Musselburgh full pelt he`s likely to end up in Prestonpans.

HELLO

Possibly if you do not know what you have beaten.

What is in front is not as important compared to those that are behind. What in front is only relevant when you know what you have bet.

THANK YOU

VINCENT