people will be heartbroken because ther whole world re VDW was based on the past examples, many vdwers don't bother with racing at all...just like discussing 30 year old races...which it now appears had no relevanmce whatsover

i don't know whats coming next...is santa not real either?

quote:

people will be heartbroken because ther whole world re VDW was based on the past examples

But that hasn't changed Those past examples are still there in black & white.

George Best ended up an alcoholic and a wife-beater but it shouldn't stop people trying to emulate his awesome football ability.

I really don't understand this. What if I gave you a method that I said I'd checked back over 10 years and it produced unbelievable profits, you tested it yourself and it was profitable and you went on to use it for 3 years with great results.... I then admitted I'd lied and hadn't really back-checked it, I just made it up on the spot. Are you now going to stop using it despite the profits because I lied in the first place?

but Andy

no one has EVER posted a series of VDW selections over a period of time and shown a profit...so the fact that these ideas MAY have worked is not relevant

now I might be wrong...but isn't the gist of this thread that VDW NEVER really existed..and the guy that wrote the letters...just picked any old races out that suited his purpose...with no actual connection between any of them.

I'm not knocking the basics..what I am saying is that those with bugger all interest in backing horses in the future...but have a university degree in why Prominent King was a VDW selection...have wasted 30 years of their lives.

it's those "students" who will be heartbroken

You talk such good sense ectoo, that I would be proud to call you a son of mine.

"VDW" must be laughing his socks off even if he is in his eighties now, and Tony Peach must take some of the flak for the delusion.

"VDW" never, not once, proofed a selection pre-race. He would be laughed off the boards today. Yes, the excuse is that it was not possible in those days before the internet - but surely he could have phoned Peach the paymaster pre-race to proof them?

I think ectoo is fairly correct in his summing up.

I've never once looked at a VDW race, never given the claim of a 80% S/R a second thought or indeed gone looking for a 'missing link' or 'key'. However, I have read and as I understood it broadly applied a VDW approach to my punting i.e. form, consistance, ability (is there any other way?)and I stand by my previous remark that the quality of VDW's observtions/knowledge should not be dismissed lightly.

I assume from the silence that the quantity and quality of the information evidence to back up the claims of having identifed VDW will remain secret - known only to the 'specials ones'.

Whisper

My dear friend, never fear VDW was a true pro of the turf. I have spent the last 2 years looking and checking posts and Lee, Guest,Statajack are the Posts to digest for a full understanding of this very generous and unselfish man's methods.

My neighbour died recently and left seven million pounds. He was a near recluse who lived in disguise of a fallen man. The moral is never judge A book by it's cover, VDW's sound wisdom is proof that he was a true pro of the turf.

Forgive me for not posting often, I have a reason for this and is physical.

Good evening to you all.

Trypod

Posted December 21, 2007 10:40 PM Hide Post
I notice Walter (A disbeliver in the revelations)
Hasnt been on since Page 4

Has he been welcomed into the band of worthy deciples

and enlightened with the actual evidence?

If so why not lay the evidence in front of a spokesperson for the rest of us that are less worthy

Then we can take the Piss

Boozer, i have not been welcomed into the band of worthy deciples for a long time since, rest easy.

Whot Ho Walter, long time no hear.

Sad news about the Motherwell Captain -
especially so at this time of year -

Aye Imp,
By all accounts Phil was a well respected guy much like Davie Cooper another ex Motherwell player who died of a brain haemorrhage a few years back.
These things happen in life and as always they put things into perspective, that`s why we should `nt take each other too seriously.
Davie was widely known as a bit of a joker as well, and a wonderful bloke to boot.

quote:

Lee, Guest,Statajack are the Posts to digest for a full understanding of this very generous and unselfish man's methods.

Trypod,

Have to admit to being a little confused by the above statment. As far as I can see all of the three mentioned work in slightly different ways. So can they all be right, and which parts of their different thinking do we take as the bits to study to gain an understanding?

Guest ranks his c/form horses 1st 2nd 3rd.etc. Lee appears to work from lists, but both use the a/rating. Statajack voiced quite serious doubts about the a/rating not being used in the early examples at least.

Be Lucky

hi mtoto, you mentioned statajack, voiced concerns about the ability rating being used in the early examples..what value do we know put on this information?..hensmen, has withdrew any further information albeit on a private forum..the vast majority of van der wheil, folllowers are being excluded from vital knowledge? were does all of this lead to further discussions on this board? on van der wheil, methods if the more expieranced contributors are staying away

This message has been edited. Last edited by: grundy,

Grundy,

I only mentioned Statajack's doubts about the a/rating as it is in marked contrast to the other two mentioned. I don't quite understand how these three can be held up as helpful in their approach when they are so different.

Where does the new information leave this or any other board with its discussions? I can only speak for myself but it hasn't change that much for me. I don't care if VDW was a rich Dutch business man or not. I have always had some doubts about the 80% strike rate, with win bets anyway. Apart from the name VDW I have never read anything (I know for a fact to written by VDW) to suggest HE was as advertised, Dutch, rich, etc. The only "bone" I can see he used was the 29 winners from 32 bets, and here he didn't say they were win bets.

I can see the 80% could be achieved if folk are VERY selective and some very short priced selections are waited for. The amount of money needed to make the bets worthwhile is well outside my comfort zone, staking £250 to win £250 really doesn't appeal. That isn't for me, why take a short price about a horse winning when better prices can be found about a horse placing?

Be Lucky

i agree mtoto, getting value odds is more harder to find..pricewise, other tipsters seem to genarate a lot of interest giving false prices by the big bookmakers.. i remember van der wheil, stating about value odds with his evaualtion on beldale flutter, although i have lost my original copy..if any members still have this ?

quote:

Have to admit to being a little confused by the above statment. As far as I can see all of the three mentioned work in slightly different ways. So can they all be right, and which parts of their different thinking do we take as the bits to study to gain an understanding?

Mtoto

They all use recent form, whether it's the Roushayd method or the consistency method.

There is a unique way of looking at a horses latest runs in VDW's eyes and from studying the posts by the poster's mentioned in my
previous post that they all use. It is logical and simple but it is crucial and vital to find it to understand what VDW was trying to get across.

A hint in the right direction would be in the most simplistic way I can discribe is " think of a salmon swimming against the current" and if he performs well AGAINST THE GRAIN, he is a horse to keep an
eye on for the future.

It's all been written by these posters before and I am sure they, if any are looking in they will agree, and I am indepted to them.

To coin a phase, a man ( M G of Kent) who wrote to the Race Form Update sometime in the late 90's " we differ in our flight paths to arrive at our conclusions, but we get there in the end".

Good night and a prosperous and happy new year to you.

Trypod

This message has been edited. Last edited by: trypod,

TRYPOD
And if he performs well AGAINST THE GRAIN he is a horse to keep an eye on.
May i ask two questions 1)How do we know when the horse will be swimming against the current 2)How do we know he has performed well AGAINST THE GRAIN.

Happy new year
Paul

Oh dear. Did no one think to tell Colin?

Just had a letter from Colin Davey. Here's an extract:

"In fact, I had found a system that could find just 2 or 3 bets a week with nearly every one winning and prices up to 6/1. I always knew there was a real winning system out there because just after the Second World War, a Dutchan called Char Van der Wheil, made millions betting on horses. This guy is a legend in the horseracing world - please check him out on the Internet".



("Char" is in the letter).

Basically, he's flogging his little booklet "The Colin Davey Method" for £27.

Ah the magical marketing ploy!

If the price ends in a '7' then you just can't resist emptying your wallet and sending off for it!

Iam a follower of the vdw methods and it has been an absorbing pastime .a few years ago i found a way of making it pay ,using a 20 point bank i managed to double twice, with more experiance its possible to make 60 points a year,sometimes it was a little hairy had 8 concective losers, but now more confidant,the selections this year were LIJO DE ROUGE WON-SPRING LOVER LOST AZTEC WARRIOR LOST so thats 57 points to go ,a fasinating and profitable hobby all thanks to VDW ADIOS BERT

Aztec Warrior is on my list for this season Bert he is down to run at Wincanton on Saturday with (11st-11lb) from a mark of (133) in the (Connaught Cup Chase) class (3) 0-135) 3m 1f Soft (19) declared.
It will be interesting to see which ones stand their ground, at this stage however he has the profile of a horse still in the throws of being prepared for a win so im not convinced that Saturday`s race is the target for him.