Just laid chamardal there at Uttoxeter post it up soon as.

2008-05-17
19:12 5254079081 2008-05-17
19:05 GB Uttox 17th May / 19:05 2m Hcap Chs
2008-05-17
19:12 5254079081 2008-05-17
19:05 GB Uttox 17th May / 19:05 2m Hcap Chs / Charmahal
Lay 5.60 Won

Doing really well so far.

Ive won a right few quid dont want to say how much but a good week`s waqes then some if your a tradesman.

Well done Walter! That's what it's all about

BC incoming place bet for Cornus to place think he may be 3rd?.

Doncaster 7:45

1st (4) Charles Darwin 4-1
2nd (9) Rainbow Fox 7-2 Fav
3rd (3) Cornus 5-1
8 ran

I'm off to watch some TV while you make some more money Walt!

2008-05-17
19:55 5254482282 2008-05-17
19:45 GB Donc 17th May / 19:45 To Be Placed
19:55 5254482282 2008-05-17
19:45 GB Donc 17th May / 19:45 To Be Placed / Cornus
Back 2.06 Won

Not finished yet, pissed! but not finished.

2008-05-17
20:23 5254750327 2008-05-17
20:15 GB Uttox 17th May / 20:10 3m Hcap Hrd
20:23 5254750327 2008-05-17
20:15 GB Uttox 17th May / 20:10 3m Hcap Hrd / Kahrayn
Lay 7.00 Won

well done walter,..anyone tried to post anything on the vdw forum, cannot access any information..or post any new topics..

quote:

Originally posted by Mtoto:
Let them tell us again that VDW didn't know what he was talking about, or that he didn't indeed SPELL IT ALL OUT.

JohnD,

Have to admit the above has me puzzled. As far as I can see there are very few on this forum that say VDW didn't know what he is/was talking about. Even more puzzling to me is the last few words of that post.

If SIAO is used as any sort of guide, how does it help find Allied Power? Using the suggested procedures the third/fourth most valuable race at Newbury wouldn't have been used. I also have grave doubts about the hindsight used when judging the tainer intent. I read the facts as AP was being aimed at the 1st York race and was pulled out because of the going, he was also pulled out of the 2nd race for the same reason. The only well thought out bit of the race planning was to enter him at Newbury in a race he wouldn't be eligible for in the near future. The trainer then ran this fit in form horse in the much weaker race and it paid of. Thinking on his feet yes, but part of of some great plan, no.

I have no doubt you will say but VDW said his methods work in any race, agreed. However there can be no doubt if SIOA was followed as written AP wouldn't have been a selection. The same goes for the early selections no matter how hard you argue against it, MANY of those selections wouldn't have been made using that usless article. It CLEARLY says which races to look at, and it CLEARLY says MUST be in the top four for ability. It doesn't say take the top four and work down UNTIL a contender is found, it draws a line the top four.

BC,

None of this is aimed at you, and I agree VDW would have considered AP as a good bet, perhaps even a good thing. I think like PK AP was the clear c/form horse and could be found using EXACTLY the same template.

Sean Rua,

Have to say my bare ratings come up with the same four as you, albeit in a slightly different order.........

Cesare
Creachadoir
Rob Roy
Al Qasi

However unlike you I wouldn't be surprised if none of them win it. I have some serious doubts about the course for all of them. The biggest doubt being against Cesare, even toying with laying him.

Be Lucky

Mtoto

So the man you've spent infinite hours studying and writing about was useless, and the article where he said he'd spelt it all out, and referred back to again and again is meaningless? What a strange world you have to live in to make your ideas fit!

The only well thought out bit of the race planning was to enter him at Newbury in a race he wouldn't be eligible for in the near future. The trainer then ran this fit in form horse in the much weaker race and it paid of. Thinking on his feet yes, but part of of some great plan, no.

No great plan, just pure common sense, the same common sense that VDW suggested it was, and you and so many others refuse to apply to his work.

If SIAO is used as any sort of guide, how does it help find Allied Power? Using the suggested procedures the third/fourth most valuable race at Newbury wouldn't have been used.

You have noticed that he said the method works at all levels.

This particular race was chosen by BC, and I passed on what I thought might be some useful commments, as I had when the same horse had not run previously. It might not matter how the horse is placed in your little world, it certainly did in VDW's.

MANY of those selections wouldn't have been made using that usless article. It CLEARLY says which races to look at, and it CLEARLY says MUST be in the top four for ability.

Perhaps you should read it again?
He actually said mark off the 4 highest ability ratings, nowhere did he say a selection must be amongst them.

Keep smiling

Two nice winners there, johnd!

And I don't know how many Walt had!

I can't see the link with vdw myself, but, as somebody said

" a winner is a winner".

Ive only been playing for fun money as such, but its built up to a fair amount now, the original bet was taken from my fun bank.
Have put quite a bit on Big Brown to win the Preakness at 1.31, though have taken a small profit and my original stake out as i dont want to lose it all if Big Brown gets himself beat in here.

Deary me, steering job won as he liked, pissed the race! that`s me now away to my bed.

So the man you've spent infinite hours studying and writing about was useless, and the article where he said he'd spelt it all out, and referred back to again and again is meaningless?

JohnD,

I have said on many occasions VDW was ahead of his time, and very knowledgeable. I said that this article is usless NOT VDW.

Have to say I read your last post with great interest, you seem to be saying although it is called SIAO it does nothing of the sort. Agreed he had said the method works at all levels, but he went on to say..........It often happens that other races on a card will lend themselves to this method, especially at the principal meeting, but endeavour to keep as far as possible to the upper limits. Moving away from the basic principle starts to put the odds against you. Attention is going to be centred on the better class races, so it must follow that the better class horses should be looked for. So JohnD chooses to ignore that advice!! Advice one can see VDW practised, when only ONE many examples (here I'm not 100% sure all his horses from the to follow lists) fall in that requirment. There can be no doubt VDW stuck to the better class races.

He actually said mark off the 4 highest ability ratings, nowhere did he say a selection must be amongst them.

Why then bother to say mark of the top four? Is he not just confirming the suggestion given when the ability rating was first revelled..............For obvious reasons this is not foolproof, but at least it enables a better judgement to be made and usually it is unwise to stray from the top few. That doesn't hold up when the early examples are studied, a fair proportion of then would stuggle to fit that requirement. In all fairness he did later go on to explain, but not in SIAO, how some of these selections were found. Even then while extending the range for consistent horses he cut the ability to the three best.

I can see NOTHING in SIAO that helps understand what VDW was actually doing. I am quite happy to ignore the whole article as he had explained or shown in his other work how the method really works. VDW for dummies can safely have a line put straight through it. It is just an article to please Mr Peach, and to explain how to use a rating I'm sure VDW didn't use himself to measure ability.

Be Lucky

Dear All

Crikey just had a look at the last few pages, seems we are all over the place or then maybe it is me?

Not able to address any points at the mo but just as a starter consistency I THINK is the key the rest falls into place later?

I look at the simple approach to get started but then the hard work kicks in and what most thought was a system turns out to be a method.

In there is the big difference and a reason in my opinion why his Nibs only went 80/20 (or is that another hidden meaning LOL) on his shortlist. Right off to have a shufty.

Kind Regards

Paul (real name)

Where is the spellcheck? Oh feck it.

roem

Welcome.
There are no 'hidden' meanings - apart from those invented by some to make their ideas fit. VDW went out of his way to verify that when he said of SIAO "It was there for you to see, and it was not covered up"
Totally agree that consistency is the bedrock starting point.

Mtoto

"Have to say I read your last post with great interest, you seem to be saying although it is called SIAO it does nothing of the sort. Agreed he had said the method works at all levels, but he went on to say..........It often happens that other races on a card will lend themselves to this method, especially at the principal meeting, but endeavour to keep as far as possible to the upper limits. Moving away from the basic principle starts to put the odds against you. Attention is going to be centred on the better class races, so it must follow that the better class horses should be looked for. So JohnD chooses to ignore that advice!! Advice one can see VDW practised, when only ONE many examples (here I'm not 100% sure all his horses from the to follow lists) fall in that requirment. There can be no doubt VDW stuck to the better class races."

Can't ever recall VDW saying that we couldn't discuss other races on a message board?
The discussion was pertaining to a horse selected by BC, and followed up by Walter in saying "get to know your horses". I simply added the rejoinder that is also as well to learn how they are placed.
Having said all that, there can be little doubt that Allied Powers was better class, and a reason to celebrate VDW, not to rubbish him.